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John McDonnell's avatar

I'm curious what you think of historical attempts at a sacred goal. Do you view it as something that was common in past societies or something that is basically unprecedented?

Although cultures can vary quite a bit my guess is there are some cultural changes that are much more difficult to achieve than others and sacred goal seems to me a) quite hard to achieve and b) certain flavors are much harder than others.

When I think of historical precedents, I think of things like the Carolingian courts interest in "correctio" (reforming society along the lines of the Kingdom of God), the Iranian revolutionaries, or Marxism-Leninism. The immediate things that come to mind are a) these were the focus of a small set of elites rather than broad based although the elites did a lot of compulsory "education" and b) they were generally more about establishing an ideology that would determine how the state should be governed more than a clear measurable objective.

When I think of clear measurable objectives these are rarer but you get things like the United States manifest destiny, the Crusades, or Nazi "lebensraum", which are basically expansion oriented. There was also the Kingdom of Babel which I think is included in the bible as a way of making the point that society _can't_ be structured that way because people just basically don't cooperate long enough to see it through.

I'm super curious to hear how you would see this idea stacked against historical examples.

James R. Carey's avatar

The sacred goal is the same now as it has always been. The sacred goal is that we take care of each other.

What did change was the definition of “we” at the origin of our species. For our pre-origin ancestors, “we” were the members of the single-family (genetically homogeneous) social system. For our post-origin ancestors, “we” were the members of the multi-family (genetically heterogeneous and culturally homogeneous) band-sized (no bigger than Dunbar’s number of 150 individuals) social system.

The definition of “we” changed again when system size increased at the dawn of the Neolithic Period (because human population density exceeded the hunter-gatherer carrying capacity of roughly 2 square miles per mouth).

Today, we are all members of one global social system numbering more than eight billion individuals. Whether we have accepted that reality is readily apparent in our behavior.

Adam Smith expressed his acceptance of that reality in the name of his book, “The Theory of Moral Sentiments” (1759). Real capitalism thrives while it rests on that solid moral foundation. Phony capitalism exists because people (Milton Friedman and others) promote the idea that capitalism without morality is so much easier (and it is, but only for the powerful and only in the short term).

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