A new JAMA study finds a strong correlation: the third of folks who eat the least salt die over three times as often as the third of folks who eat the most salt. Yet other studies almost as big find contrary effects. I find it quite disturbing that such big studies can show such different results; something is very wrong in big diet correlation study land. Details:
Dietary science is dominated by skinny, obsessive-compulsive middle-class women with eating disorders who want to share their pathological disgust of food with others. As someone who has ended up in the field for very different reasons, I can't imagine an area of science more strongly dominated by a cargo cult-level scientism (except for maybe psychology…). It's like being taught portraiture by the colour-blind; they seemingly have no idea how strongly their understanding is coloured by their class values and pathological tendencies.
vitamin A is essential, yet to much is highly toxic (thats why you don't eat polar bear liver, should it ever be offered to you)in other words, the human body has a limited capacity to adjust; to much oxygen is bad, to little is bad, etc etc
Health parameters take on the absolutist aspects of religious doctrine. This study shows that everyone (practically) eat enough to maintain their sodium level at a very steady level. Population based efforts to control salt intake show no success in terms of increases in longevity. At best you can reduce measurable parameters such as blood pressure. This then becomes an assumed surrogate for increased longevity. Observational studies of people who live on salt poor diets don’t get age related hypertension. This is the main evidence that salt restriction in healthy people is beneficial. Salt intake has been declared a national emergency. It is an incitement of American life, capitalism the food industry. This is based, as far as I can tell, upon pretty firm observation that salt /age related systolic hypertension does not occur in people who eat a salt poor diet. There is always a lot of selectivity to these studies. This study could be criticized too and will be. There are only relatively young white people involved and as usual the study is for a limited time frame with limited sampling intervals. However, internationally, who are the low salt consuming people? They can’t be the Japanese, the longest living people on average on earth. I have traveled around some and have found nowhere that people don’t eat salt in there food. Perhaps they are the same mythological people who eat all whole grain foods while the Asians eat white rice and the Mediterraneans eat white pasta white, rice and white potatoes.Of course there are problems with the Western life style, such as too much animal fat and sugar and lack of exercise. Still average longevity is increasing. Also, salt reduction is a valid part of the treatment of hypertension and some other conditions.
Many Thanks for the link!Gaah! It's amazing how inconclusive observational epidemiologycan be. I'm giving up on what to conclude about the effect of salton hypertension till I see a 10,000 patient double-blind, randomizedplacebo-controlled prospective study :-(
Yes, there's definitely something wrong with people who die three times as often as other people. I think death should be a once-in-a-lifetime sort of thing, not something you do regularly just because you don't like salt.
If we accept parental survival positively influences offspring fitness, which seems fairly obvious, then yes, evolution does tend to control for long-term effects. The question becomes how far along this evolutionary process is. In other words, how long have humans been consuming salt. Considering hunter-gatherer societies at moment of contact, they indeed consume large amounts of salt, even at great expense (c.f. inland salt prices).
By the way, it seems like a lot of people on this thread have dubbed themselves experts on dietetics based on reading a smattering of books or a blog or two by somebody they like.
Dietary science is dominated by skinny, obsessive-compulsive middle-class women with eating disorders who want to share their pathological disgust of food with others. As someone who has ended up in the field for very different reasons, I can't imagine an area of science more strongly dominated by a cargo cult-level scientism (except for maybe psychology…). It's like being taught portraiture by the colour-blind; they seemingly have no idea how strongly their understanding is coloured by their class values and pathological tendencies.
vitamin A is essential, yet to much is highly toxic (thats why you don't eat polar bear liver, should it ever be offered to you)in other words, the human body has a limited capacity to adjust; to much oxygen is bad, to little is bad, etc etc
Health parameters take on the absolutist aspects of religious doctrine. This study shows that everyone (practically) eat enough to maintain their sodium level at a very steady level. Population based efforts to control salt intake show no success in terms of increases in longevity. At best you can reduce measurable parameters such as blood pressure. This then becomes an assumed surrogate for increased longevity. Observational studies of people who live on salt poor diets don’t get age related hypertension. This is the main evidence that salt restriction in healthy people is beneficial. Salt intake has been declared a national emergency. It is an incitement of American life, capitalism the food industry. This is based, as far as I can tell, upon pretty firm observation that salt /age related systolic hypertension does not occur in people who eat a salt poor diet. There is always a lot of selectivity to these studies. This study could be criticized too and will be. There are only relatively young white people involved and as usual the study is for a limited time frame with limited sampling intervals. However, internationally, who are the low salt consuming people? They can’t be the Japanese, the longest living people on average on earth. I have traveled around some and have found nowhere that people don’t eat salt in there food. Perhaps they are the same mythological people who eat all whole grain foods while the Asians eat white rice and the Mediterraneans eat white pasta white, rice and white potatoes.Of course there are problems with the Western life style, such as too much animal fat and sugar and lack of exercise. Still average longevity is increasing. Also, salt reduction is a valid part of the treatment of hypertension and some other conditions.
Many Thanks for the link!Gaah! It's amazing how inconclusive observational epidemiologycan be. I'm giving up on what to conclude about the effect of salton hypertension till I see a 10,000 patient double-blind, randomizedplacebo-controlled prospective study :-(
The Taubes article, political science of salt available here.
http://www.stat.berkeley.ed...
third archevore
Epic win!
That review reports that they used a single measurement of salt excretion to cover an eight year period. That is complete nonsense.
Third the archevore recommendation
So, the only reason is that it may, possibly, not be well-balanced for the very long term?
That feeling fit and healthy in the short term (re: diet) tends to lead to illness in the long term?
::dies laughing::
Yes, there's definitely something wrong with people who die three times as often as other people. I think death should be a once-in-a-lifetime sort of thing, not something you do regularly just because you don't like salt.
If we accept parental survival positively influences offspring fitness, which seems fairly obvious, then yes, evolution does tend to control for long-term effects. The question becomes how far along this evolutionary process is. In other words, how long have humans been consuming salt. Considering hunter-gatherer societies at moment of contact, they indeed consume large amounts of salt, even at great expense (c.f. inland salt prices).
http://www.hsph.harvard.edu...
Passing this along without comment.
Re: post-procreational longevity
Not necessarily. Kin/group selection would be a factor.
Sodium chloride is just one type of salt.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...
By the way, it seems like a lot of people on this thread have dubbed themselves experts on dietetics based on reading a smattering of books or a blog or two by somebody they like.