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	<title>Comments on: In Praise Of Blackmail</title>
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	<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/10/in-praise-of-extortion.html</link>
	<description>Overcoming Bias is economist Robin Hanson’s blog, on honesty, signaling, disagreement, forecasting, and the far future.</description>
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		<title>By: Seth</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/10/in-praise-of-extortion.html#comment-434444</link>
		<dc:creator>Seth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Oct 2009 15:02:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overcomingbias.com/?p=19963#comment-434444</guid>
		<description>No wealth created?  Celebs don&#039;t come out ahead by hiding damaging information?  Or adoring fans benefit by not adoring  celebs quite as much.

&quot;Why promote whistleblowers but ban blackmail?&quot;   To tilt favor towards us interested third parties.  It gives us a better chance to bid on the blackmailer&#039;s information.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No wealth created?  Celebs don&#8217;t come out ahead by hiding damaging information?  Or adoring fans benefit by not adoring  celebs quite as much.</p>
<p>&#8220;Why promote whistleblowers but ban blackmail?&#8221;   To tilt favor towards us interested third parties.  It gives us a better chance to bid on the blackmailer&#8217;s information.</p>
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		<title>By: Tyler Willis</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/10/in-praise-of-extortion.html#comment-434342</link>
		<dc:creator>Tyler Willis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Oct 2009 01:37:40 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Ascertain s/b assertion -- sorry, long day.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ascertain s/b assertion &#8212; sorry, long day.</p>
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		<title>By: Tyler Willis</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/10/in-praise-of-extortion.html#comment-434341</link>
		<dc:creator>Tyler Willis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Oct 2009 01:36:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overcomingbias.com/?p=19963#comment-434341</guid>
		<description>Robin,

I think your ascertain that legalizing blackmail would be a net-positive my be incorrect, for the following reasons:

1)  It would actually encourage less overall information to come out. Victims of blackmail would not be able to go to the police for help with the situation, therefore they would have an option of recourse removed -- raising the likelihood of them choosing other options: including payment of the ask.

2)  It creates fear in members of the general society -- this is not a concern if we&#039;re talking about drug dealing or cheating, but there are many things not illegal/immoral that a productive participant in our society should be able to engage in with some expectation of privacy. A productive person spending more energy to hide the relatively mundance things they do not want made public for cultural/familial/etc. reasons (sexual fetishes, cigarette smoking, etc.) means less energy spent on creating value.

3) While none of the likely outcomes of legal blackmail you laid out are particularly concerning, there&#039;s also nothing on that list I find positive.  Furthermore, I think it is an incomplete list.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Robin,</p>
<p>I think your ascertain that legalizing blackmail would be a net-positive my be incorrect, for the following reasons:</p>
<p>1)  It would actually encourage less overall information to come out. Victims of blackmail would not be able to go to the police for help with the situation, therefore they would have an option of recourse removed &#8212; raising the likelihood of them choosing other options: including payment of the ask.</p>
<p>2)  It creates fear in members of the general society &#8212; this is not a concern if we&#8217;re talking about drug dealing or cheating, but there are many things not illegal/immoral that a productive participant in our society should be able to engage in with some expectation of privacy. A productive person spending more energy to hide the relatively mundance things they do not want made public for cultural/familial/etc. reasons (sexual fetishes, cigarette smoking, etc.) means less energy spent on creating value.</p>
<p>3) While none of the likely outcomes of legal blackmail you laid out are particularly concerning, there&#8217;s also nothing on that list I find positive.  Furthermore, I think it is an incomplete list.</p>
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		<title>By: Seff</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/10/in-praise-of-extortion.html#comment-434270</link>
		<dc:creator>Seff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Oct 2009 20:16:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overcomingbias.com/?p=19963#comment-434270</guid>
		<description>The difference is: Whistle blowing is a finite event.  Blackmail can be a series of events.  Blackmailer, &quot;I want a mil or I&#039;ll talk&quot; Mark, &quot;Ok&quot;.  Six months later, Blackmailer, &quot;I want a mil or I&#039;ll talk&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The difference is: Whistle blowing is a finite event.  Blackmail can be a series of events.  Blackmailer, &#8220;I want a mil or I&#8217;ll talk&#8221; Mark, &#8220;Ok&#8221;.  Six months later, Blackmailer, &#8220;I want a mil or I&#8217;ll talk&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/10/in-praise-of-extortion.html#comment-434262</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Oct 2009 12:49:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overcomingbias.com/?p=19963#comment-434262</guid>
		<description>I spent some time trying to understand Walter Block’s ideas on blackmail. Quite frankly if blackmail is covered under the non aggression principle, it doesn’t feel right.

“In blackmail, however, what is being “threatened” is something
that the blackmailer does have a right to do!—whether it be exercising
the right of free speech, or refusing to patronize certain
stores, or persuading others to do likewise. What is being threatened
is not in itself illegitimate; it is, therefore, not possible to
call the “threat” an illegitimate threat.”

As others have pointed out, the trouble is that combining free speech with the right to voluntary exchange, two seeming inalienable rights don’t combine so well.   It makes no sense to call blackmail voluntary exchange, even though the two have similar mechanics. All Block has done is poked a hole in the NAP. Now someone needs to repair the hole. Remember this the next time someone “Makes you an offer you can’t refuse.”</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I spent some time trying to understand Walter Block’s ideas on blackmail. Quite frankly if blackmail is covered under the non aggression principle, it doesn’t feel right.</p>
<p>“In blackmail, however, what is being “threatened” is something<br />
that the blackmailer does have a right to do!—whether it be exercising<br />
the right of free speech, or refusing to patronize certain<br />
stores, or persuading others to do likewise. What is being threatened<br />
is not in itself illegitimate; it is, therefore, not possible to<br />
call the “threat” an illegitimate threat.”</p>
<p>As others have pointed out, the trouble is that combining free speech with the right to voluntary exchange, two seeming inalienable rights don’t combine so well.   It makes no sense to call blackmail voluntary exchange, even though the two have similar mechanics. All Block has done is poked a hole in the NAP. Now someone needs to repair the hole. Remember this the next time someone “Makes you an offer you can’t refuse.”</p>
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		<title>By: jgfellow</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/10/in-praise-of-extortion.html#comment-434260</link>
		<dc:creator>jgfellow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Oct 2009 11:37:32 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I apologize if someone else already posted these two points, but (1) there is an economic benefit to society of anti-blackmailing laws: it raises the cost of extra-judicial claims relative to judicial claims.  Because someone can be charged with blackmailing, they are better off taking (legitimate) claims to court.

Incidentally, (2) it is the &quot;relative rich&quot; who get blackmailed, not the rich.  Since the latter is a larger class, a great many more are impacted than you might think.

Cheers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I apologize if someone else already posted these two points, but (1) there is an economic benefit to society of anti-blackmailing laws: it raises the cost of extra-judicial claims relative to judicial claims.  Because someone can be charged with blackmailing, they are better off taking (legitimate) claims to court.</p>
<p>Incidentally, (2) it is the &#8220;relative rich&#8221; who get blackmailed, not the rich.  Since the latter is a larger class, a great many more are impacted than you might think.</p>
<p>Cheers.</p>
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		<title>By: Greg Lee</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/10/in-praise-of-extortion.html#comment-434256</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg Lee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Oct 2009 04:21:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overcomingbias.com/?p=19963#comment-434256</guid>
		<description>&quot;If we did this, these would be the main consequences:  Rich celebrities would lose money, do fewer illicit things, lie about them less, and trust their associates less.  They’d be more often exposed for lying about doing illicit things...&quot;

The strategic-bargaining counter-argument: illegality makes the blackmailer&#039;s promise to remain silent credible and therefore worth paying for.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;If we did this, these would be the main consequences:  Rich celebrities would lose money, do fewer illicit things, lie about them less, and trust their associates less.  They’d be more often exposed for lying about doing illicit things&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>The strategic-bargaining counter-argument: illegality makes the blackmailer&#8217;s promise to remain silent credible and therefore worth paying for.</p>
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		<title>By: Colin</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/10/in-praise-of-extortion.html#comment-434255</link>
		<dc:creator>Colin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Oct 2009 03:52:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overcomingbias.com/?p=19963#comment-434255</guid>
		<description>This is pretty flawed, because you believe blackmail only applies to famous celebrities and not the general public. Blackmail is still prevalent amongst non-celebrities.

Another flaw is that legalising blackmail encourages entrapment, and a society fearful of entrapment is not a very open society.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is pretty flawed, because you believe blackmail only applies to famous celebrities and not the general public. Blackmail is still prevalent amongst non-celebrities.</p>
<p>Another flaw is that legalising blackmail encourages entrapment, and a society fearful of entrapment is not a very open society.</p>
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		<title>By: Brian Holtz</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/10/in-praise-of-extortion.html#comment-434253</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian Holtz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Oct 2009 23:26:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overcomingbias.com/?p=19963#comment-434253</guid>
		<description>&quot;Threatening to hurt someone unless they giving you money&quot; is wrong because &lt;em&gt;hurting someone is wrong&lt;/em&gt;.  Telling a truth is not wrong in anything like the same way -- if at all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Threatening to hurt someone unless they giving you money&#8221; is wrong because <em>hurting someone is wrong</em>.  Telling a truth is not wrong in anything like the same way &#8212; if at all.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Breton</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/10/in-praise-of-extortion.html#comment-434252</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Breton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Oct 2009 20:59:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.overcomingbias.com/?p=19963#comment-434252</guid>
		<description>(Different theme, so different post)

I think Steve Sailer gave the right answer - the &quot;problem&quot; is that it cuts the lawyers out.

That said, there is one consequence that AFAIK nobody has mentioned.  If you legalize blackmail, but (of course) you keep extortion by threat of libel illegal, then someone has to judge whether questionable allegations are true  or false (That&#039;s not the new part).  Now the person who is primarily judging that fact is the blackmailer (That&#039;s the new part).  That&#039;s bad news.

It would be hard to prove that the blackmailer maliciously misjudged an allegation as true (That&#039;s not new about libel law).  The blackmailer could easily claim it was an innocent mistake.  The blackmailer also might threaten in such a way that the victim perceives a threat of libel, but can only prove a threat of blackmail.  

So legalizing blackmail makes it easy to pass off extortion as (the now legal) blackmail.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(Different theme, so different post)</p>
<p>I think Steve Sailer gave the right answer &#8211; the &#8220;problem&#8221; is that it cuts the lawyers out.</p>
<p>That said, there is one consequence that AFAIK nobody has mentioned.  If you legalize blackmail, but (of course) you keep extortion by threat of libel illegal, then someone has to judge whether questionable allegations are true  or false (That&#8217;s not the new part).  Now the person who is primarily judging that fact is the blackmailer (That&#8217;s the new part).  That&#8217;s bad news.</p>
<p>It would be hard to prove that the blackmailer maliciously misjudged an allegation as true (That&#8217;s not new about libel law).  The blackmailer could easily claim it was an innocent mistake.  The blackmailer also might threaten in such a way that the victim perceives a threat of libel, but can only prove a threat of blackmail.  </p>
<p>So legalizing blackmail makes it easy to pass off extortion as (the now legal) blackmail.</p>
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