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	<title>Comments on: Emulations Go Foom</title>
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	<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/11/emulations-go-f.html</link>
	<description>Overcoming Bias is economist Robin Hanson’s blog, on honesty, signaling, disagreement, forecasting, and the far future.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 11 Feb 2012 23:23:58 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: xxd</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/11/emulations-go-f.html#comment-663441</link>
		<dc:creator>xxd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jan 2012 22:53:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/11/emulations-go-foom.html#comment-663441</guid>
		<description>There is such a thing as competitive advantage. Under this paradigm, in a two entity competition, it&#039;s *still* more productive for entity A to be producing X units of work and entity B to be producing much less than X units of work. This is simple economics.

The only case where this would fail is if entity A values the goods/services that entity B can produce to be much less than the cost to feed/house etc entity B. That&#039;s the $64 trillion dollar question.

Personally I suspect any sufficiently rational AI will want to get the hell out of dodge and leave us to our own devices because we are clearly insane.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is such a thing as competitive advantage. Under this paradigm, in a two entity competition, it&#8217;s *still* more productive for entity A to be producing X units of work and entity B to be producing much less than X units of work. This is simple economics.</p>
<p>The only case where this would fail is if entity A values the goods/services that entity B can produce to be much less than the cost to feed/house etc entity B. That&#8217;s the $64 trillion dollar question.</p>
<p>Personally I suspect any sufficiently rational AI will want to get the hell out of dodge and leave us to our own devices because we are clearly insane.</p>
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		<title>By: When robots are better at everything &#171; azmytheconomics</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/11/emulations-go-f.html#comment-502741</link>
		<dc:creator>When robots are better at everything &#171; azmytheconomics</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Sep 2011 14:40:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/11/emulations-go-foom.html#comment-502741</guid>
		<description>[...] His prediction for what will be the root cause for the singularity is &#8220;Ems&#8221; &#8211; whole brain emulations that can accurately replicate human thought. When that happens, mental work now done by humans will [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] His prediction for what will be the root cause for the singularity is &#8220;Ems&#8221; &#8211; whole brain emulations that can accurately replicate human thought. When that happens, mental work now done by humans will [...]</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Overcoming Bias : When Life Is Cheap, Death Is Cheap</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/11/emulations-go-f.html#comment-462343</link>
		<dc:creator>Overcoming Bias : When Life Is Cheap, Death Is Cheap</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Dec 2010 01:50:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/11/emulations-go-foom.html#comment-462343</guid>
		<description>[...] thank you for thoughtfully engaging my whole brain emulation scenario.  This is my [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] thank you for thoughtfully engaging my whole brain emulation scenario.  This is my [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Overcoming Bias : Wrapping Up</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/11/emulations-go-f.html#comment-462339</link>
		<dc:creator>Overcoming Bias : Wrapping Up</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Dec 2010 01:30:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/11/emulations-go-foom.html#comment-462339</guid>
		<description>[...] my preferred em (whole brain emulation) scenario, people would only authorize making em copies using borrowed or rented brains/bodies when they [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] my preferred em (whole brain emulation) scenario, people would only authorize making em copies using borrowed or rented brains/bodies when they [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Overcoming Bias : Total Tech Wars</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/11/emulations-go-f.html#comment-462338</link>
		<dc:creator>Overcoming Bias : Total Tech Wars</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Dec 2010 01:29:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/11/emulations-go-foom.html#comment-462338</guid>
		<description>[...] Shulman Saturday and Monday: I very much doubt that any U.S. or Chinese President who understood the issues would [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Shulman Saturday and Monday: I very much doubt that any U.S. or Chinese President who understood the issues would [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Overcoming Bias : Billion Dollar Bots</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/11/emulations-go-f.html#comment-462337</link>
		<dc:creator>Overcoming Bias : Billion Dollar Bots</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Dec 2010 01:28:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/11/emulations-go-foom.html#comment-462337</guid>
		<description>[...] presented a scenario in which whole brain emulations, or what he calls bots come into being.  Here is [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] presented a scenario in which whole brain emulations, or what he calls bots come into being.  Here is [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Servant</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/11/emulations-go-f.html#comment-431670</link>
		<dc:creator>Servant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Aug 2009 00:55:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/11/emulations-go-foom.html#comment-431670</guid>
		<description>An alternative scenario would be the end of individuality as we know it.

I think that human specialization is the direct result of our ability to communicate. As our communication bandwidth with other humans increases, we can specialize more, since information we don&#039;t have is likely to be accessible from someone else.

This is in its early stages - the idea of Wikipedia, or the Internet in general as an &#039;outboard brain&#039; is well known.

Now imagine the effects if we could plug our brains directly into the Internet: stream entire thought videos up and down. It would be as if we had evolved telepathy. Of course, since we haven&#039;t evolved to use telepathy it would take a lot of getting used to, but the brain is plastic and I imagine it could only lead over time to even more specialization.

In essence, humanity would become a distributed super brain.

But perhaps such high bandwidth connections are impossible or impractical with biological brains. There&#039;s no reason to suppose the same limitation would hold with uploaded brains or AIs. Again the end result is a distributed super brain.

Freeman Dyson has argued that &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.nybooks.com/articles/20370&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;biotechnology will enable a horizontal transfer of genes that will mean the end of Darwinian evolution by natural selection&lt;/a&gt;. I think AI is another route to the same end: with a distributed super brain there would be no individuality as we know it. No competition. No natural selection by death of nonfit individuals: only nonfit thoughts.

We have evolved as individuals, and it will be hard to let go of our egos. But on the plus side there will be no slavery. No malthusian death of individuals because they can&#039;t compete. Everything good about the individuals will be preserved, every idea which is more insightful than anyone else&#039;s. Everything except ... individuality.

If this sounds bad to you, consider what it&#039;s like for an individual with multiple personality disorder. Multiple egos in one brain? I believe it&#039;s rather unpleasant. Then consider that sufficiently high bandwidth telepathy would effectively unite multiple brains into one. If each brain retains its ego, you have the equivalent of super brain multiple personality disorder. Once you have that level of connection - do all those egos still serve any real purpose?

For those with a religious bent, absorption into the super mind would be the ultimate in enlightenment.

To my mind, it certainly beats starving to death while a handful of corporation owners get rich off cheap robot mind labour.

Even if this super brain scenario is avoidable - can anyone here think of a better alternative?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>An alternative scenario would be the end of individuality as we know it.</p>
<p>I think that human specialization is the direct result of our ability to communicate. As our communication bandwidth with other humans increases, we can specialize more, since information we don&#8217;t have is likely to be accessible from someone else.</p>
<p>This is in its early stages &#8211; the idea of Wikipedia, or the Internet in general as an &#8216;outboard brain&#8217; is well known.</p>
<p>Now imagine the effects if we could plug our brains directly into the Internet: stream entire thought videos up and down. It would be as if we had evolved telepathy. Of course, since we haven&#8217;t evolved to use telepathy it would take a lot of getting used to, but the brain is plastic and I imagine it could only lead over time to even more specialization.</p>
<p>In essence, humanity would become a distributed super brain.</p>
<p>But perhaps such high bandwidth connections are impossible or impractical with biological brains. There&#8217;s no reason to suppose the same limitation would hold with uploaded brains or AIs. Again the end result is a distributed super brain.</p>
<p>Freeman Dyson has argued that <a href="http://www.nybooks.com/articles/20370" rel="nofollow">biotechnology will enable a horizontal transfer of genes that will mean the end of Darwinian evolution by natural selection</a>. I think AI is another route to the same end: with a distributed super brain there would be no individuality as we know it. No competition. No natural selection by death of nonfit individuals: only nonfit thoughts.</p>
<p>We have evolved as individuals, and it will be hard to let go of our egos. But on the plus side there will be no slavery. No malthusian death of individuals because they can&#8217;t compete. Everything good about the individuals will be preserved, every idea which is more insightful than anyone else&#8217;s. Everything except &#8230; individuality.</p>
<p>If this sounds bad to you, consider what it&#8217;s like for an individual with multiple personality disorder. Multiple egos in one brain? I believe it&#8217;s rather unpleasant. Then consider that sufficiently high bandwidth telepathy would effectively unite multiple brains into one. If each brain retains its ego, you have the equivalent of super brain multiple personality disorder. Once you have that level of connection &#8211; do all those egos still serve any real purpose?</p>
<p>For those with a religious bent, absorption into the super mind would be the ultimate in enlightenment.</p>
<p>To my mind, it certainly beats starving to death while a handful of corporation owners get rich off cheap robot mind labour.</p>
<p>Even if this super brain scenario is avoidable &#8211; can anyone here think of a better alternative?</p>
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		<title>By: Overcoming Bias : A Test of Moral Progress</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/11/emulations-go-f.html#comment-431647</link>
		<dc:creator>Overcoming Bias : A Test of Moral Progress</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 Aug 2009 18:12:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/11/emulations-go-foom.html#comment-431647</guid>
		<description>[...] morality.   I expect we will actually see a future of much lower per-capita wealth, after the em transition, but it is hard to see a narrowing circle of interactions until there is substantial [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] morality.   I expect we will actually see a future of much lower per-capita wealth, after the em transition, but it is hard to see a narrowing circle of interactions until there is substantial [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Overcoming Bias : Pro &#8220;Slavery&#8221; OpEd</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/11/emulations-go-f.html#comment-425203</link>
		<dc:creator>Overcoming Bias : Pro &#8220;Slavery&#8221; OpEd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Jun 2009 03:06:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/11/emulations-go-foom.html#comment-425203</guid>
		<description>[...] in this issue because of its close relation to the whole brain emulation I have discussed before (here and here).  Note that the em case seems easier since em copies would be adults immediately, and [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] in this issue because of its close relation to the whole brain emulation I have discussed before (here and here).  Note that the em case seems easier since em copies would be adults immediately, and [...]</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Robin Hanson</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/11/emulations-go-f.html#comment-425904</link>
		<dc:creator>Robin Hanson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 18:55:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/11/emulations-go-foom.html#comment-425904</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Tim, you&#039;ve made seven comments on this post, half of them to explain why you don&#039;t think it is worth talking about.  You doth protest too much.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tim, you&#8217;ve made seven comments on this post, half of them to explain why you don&#8217;t think it is worth talking about.  You doth protest too much.</p>
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