<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Wilkinson on Paternalism</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/03/wilkinson-on-pa.html/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/03/wilkinson-on-pa.html</link>
	<description>Overcoming Bias is economist Robin Hanson’s blog, on honesty, signaling, disagreement, forecasting, and the far future.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 15 Mar 2010 01:52:16 -0400</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Yvain</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/03/wilkinson-on-pa.html#comment-407391</link>
		<dc:creator>Yvain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Mar 2008 11:10:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/03/wilkinson-on-paternalism.html#comment-407391</guid>
		<description>Alan, that&#039;s quite interesting. Is the study about diet and inmate behavior online anywhere? My own experience with government-issued diets is the school lunches I get every day as a teacher, and I&#039;m always impressed with them - but I acknowledge that other programs might not be as good.

Robin, I agree that the solutions you provide above are very good ones. No doubt if people are rational enough to use them, they will work better than paternalist intervention would. But people will only use those solutions after they realize they&#039;re being irrational. The advantage of paternalism is that as long as people recognize someone else is being irrational, they can help him regardless of whether that person know he&#039;s being irrational himself. And in my experience, most irrational people don&#039;t know they&#039;re being irrational; I certainly didn&#039;t before I started reading this blog.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alan, that&#8217;s quite interesting. Is the study about diet and inmate behavior online anywhere? My own experience with government-issued diets is the school lunches I get every day as a teacher, and I&#8217;m always impressed with them &#8211; but I acknowledge that other programs might not be as good.</p>
<p>Robin, I agree that the solutions you provide above are very good ones. No doubt if people are rational enough to use them, they will work better than paternalist intervention would. But people will only use those solutions after they realize they&#8217;re being irrational. The advantage of paternalism is that as long as people recognize someone else is being irrational, they can help him regardless of whether that person know he&#8217;s being irrational himself. And in my experience, most irrational people don&#8217;t know they&#8217;re being irrational; I certainly didn&#8217;t before I started reading this blog.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Alan Crowe</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/03/wilkinson-on-pa.html#comment-407390</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Crowe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Mar 2008 18:20:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/03/wilkinson-on-paternalism.html#comment-407390</guid>
		<description>Yvain, in the UK we have good evidence that prisoners behave better with more nutritious food. Poor diet is leading to erratic behaviour. Unfortunately the Home Office never gets round to acting on this. So the prison inmate example serves to persuade us Brits that paternalism doesn&#039;t work.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yvain, in the UK we have good evidence that prisoners behave better with more nutritious food. Poor diet is leading to erratic behaviour. Unfortunately the Home Office never gets round to acting on this. So the prison inmate example serves to persuade us Brits that paternalism doesn&#8217;t work.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Robin Hanson</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/03/wilkinson-on-pa.html#comment-407389</link>
		<dc:creator>Robin Hanson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Mar 2008 12:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/03/wilkinson-on-paternalism.html#comment-407389</guid>
		<description>Floccina, academic research won&#039;t support the claim that only 20% are irrational.

Yvian, many of the other approaches I listed also rely on less personally involved parties.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Floccina, academic research won&#8217;t support the claim that only 20% are irrational.</p>
<p>Yvian, many of the other approaches I listed also rely on less personally involved parties.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Grant</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/03/wilkinson-on-pa.html#comment-407388</link>
		<dc:creator>Grant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Mar 2008 10:29:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/03/wilkinson-on-paternalism.html#comment-407388</guid>
		<description>Yvain,

I could see how bureaucrats would be able to ignore the individual&#039;s biases, but why would it follow from that that the bureaucrat would not introduce as much bias of his own? I agree their biases would be different, but I can&#039;t see them being less.

I don&#039;t think diets are a good example, because we can&#039;t show that &quot;healthy and well-balanced&quot; is necessarily what people want. The snake oil example seems better to me, because we can objectively show that snake oil is useless. Of course, in that situation the buyer isn&#039;t purchasing a cure at all, he&#039;s purchasing self-deception or a way to show his daughter that he cares.

I haven&#039;t been here long, but I don&#039;t think gambling prohibitions are a good example on Robin Hanson&#039;s blog ;) Biases against gambling have held off innovations in decision-making (via prediction markets) for who knows how many years (decades?).
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yvain,</p>
<p>I could see how bureaucrats would be able to ignore the individual&#8217;s biases, but why would it follow from that that the bureaucrat would not introduce as much bias of his own? I agree their biases would be different, but I can&#8217;t see them being less.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think diets are a good example, because we can&#8217;t show that &#8220;healthy and well-balanced&#8221; is necessarily what people want. The snake oil example seems better to me, because we can objectively show that snake oil is useless. Of course, in that situation the buyer isn&#8217;t purchasing a cure at all, he&#8217;s purchasing self-deception or a way to show his daughter that he cares.</p>
<p>I haven&#8217;t been here long, but I don&#8217;t think gambling prohibitions are a good example on Robin Hanson&#8217;s blog <img src='http://www.overcomingbias.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' />  Biases against gambling have held off innovations in decision-making (via prediction markets) for who knows how many years (decades?).</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Yvain</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/03/wilkinson-on-pa.html#comment-407387</link>
		<dc:creator>Yvain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Mar 2008 09:50:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/03/wilkinson-on-paternalism.html#comment-407387</guid>
		<description>I might be missing something, but I see a clear reason government can be less biased. A paternalistic government can be less biased than individuals because it&#039;s less personally involved with the situations it considers. Bureaucrats making future decisions for other people are less likely to be biased than a person making a decision for himself right now.

Consider diets. Most people choose their own diet. Some people, like prison inmates and students in school lunch programs, get their diets chosen by the government. Most people who choose their own diet will to one degree or another make decisions based on temporary desires (&quot;I&#039;m really in the mood for a bacon burger&quot;). But the government bureaucrats who decide other people&#039;s diets have no personal stake in the matter, and usually end up designing something healthy and well-balanced.

Another example is gambling. Most countries have either banned or restricted it for paternalistic reasons. If you&#039;re in Vegas and really need a few hundred bucks quick, it&#039;s pretty hard to resist the temptation to play the slots. But if you&#039;re in Washington D.C. thinking about the costs and benefits, it&#039;s easy to decide that the latter outweigh the former.

Or to take a favorite example of Robin&#039;s, consider health care. If your daughter&#039;s dying of cancer, and someone tells you in a very sincere voice that snake oil is certain to save her life and can be yours for the low, low price of $999.99, you&#039;ll probably buy the snake oil even though all those ivory tower scientists in the Vast Allopathic Conspiracy say it doesn&#039;t work. Doctors tell me stories about this sort of thing all the time. It&#039;s much easier for a bureaucrat in D.C. to review the evidence, decide snake oil should be banned as quackery, and save you a thousand dollars.

This isn&#039;t to say that governments aren&#039;t prone to different sorts of errors, like those springing from corruption, but they don&#039;t need to suffer exactly the same biases that their individual citizens do.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I might be missing something, but I see a clear reason government can be less biased. A paternalistic government can be less biased than individuals because it&#8217;s less personally involved with the situations it considers. Bureaucrats making future decisions for other people are less likely to be biased than a person making a decision for himself right now.</p>
<p>Consider diets. Most people choose their own diet. Some people, like prison inmates and students in school lunch programs, get their diets chosen by the government. Most people who choose their own diet will to one degree or another make decisions based on temporary desires (&#8221;I&#8217;m really in the mood for a bacon burger&#8221;). But the government bureaucrats who decide other people&#8217;s diets have no personal stake in the matter, and usually end up designing something healthy and well-balanced.</p>
<p>Another example is gambling. Most countries have either banned or restricted it for paternalistic reasons. If you&#8217;re in Vegas and really need a few hundred bucks quick, it&#8217;s pretty hard to resist the temptation to play the slots. But if you&#8217;re in Washington D.C. thinking about the costs and benefits, it&#8217;s easy to decide that the latter outweigh the former.</p>
<p>Or to take a favorite example of Robin&#8217;s, consider health care. If your daughter&#8217;s dying of cancer, and someone tells you in a very sincere voice that snake oil is certain to save her life and can be yours for the low, low price of $999.99, you&#8217;ll probably buy the snake oil even though all those ivory tower scientists in the Vast Allopathic Conspiracy say it doesn&#8217;t work. Doctors tell me stories about this sort of thing all the time. It&#8217;s much easier for a bureaucrat in D.C. to review the evidence, decide snake oil should be banned as quackery, and save you a thousand dollars.</p>
<p>This isn&#8217;t to say that governments aren&#8217;t prone to different sorts of errors, like those springing from corruption, but they don&#8217;t need to suffer exactly the same biases that their individual citizens do.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Thomas Powers</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/03/wilkinson-on-pa.html#comment-407386</link>
		<dc:creator>Thomas Powers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Mar 2008 06:58:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/03/wilkinson-on-paternalism.html#comment-407386</guid>
		<description>Thomas Jefferson has a fairly well-known quote expressing the same sentiment:

&quot;Sometimes it is said that man cannot be trusted with the government of himself. Can he, then, be trusted with the government of others? Or have we found angels in the forms of kings to govern him? Let history answer this question.&quot;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thomas Jefferson has a fairly well-known quote expressing the same sentiment:</p>
<p>&#8220;Sometimes it is said that man cannot be trusted with the government of himself. Can he, then, be trusted with the government of others? Or have we found angels in the forms of kings to govern him? Let history answer this question.&#8221;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Grant</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/03/wilkinson-on-pa.html#comment-407385</link>
		<dc:creator>Grant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Mar 2008 06:20:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/03/wilkinson-on-paternalism.html#comment-407385</guid>
		<description>I haven&#039;t been reading this blog for long, but I wonder: could we come up with some metric for irrationality? If so, could we apply it to people in their roles as voters, politicians, consumers and entrepreneurs? I would bet a good amount of money the former two roles would be far less rational than the later two, since the costs of being irrational are much lower for them. A lot of rich people are very irrational when it comes to the &#039;finer&#039; things in life such as wine and art because they can afford to be. Event still, I&#039;d bet political irrationality is more wide-spread.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I haven&#8217;t been reading this blog for long, but I wonder: could we come up with some metric for irrationality? If so, could we apply it to people in their roles as voters, politicians, consumers and entrepreneurs? I would bet a good amount of money the former two roles would be far less rational than the later two, since the costs of being irrational are much lower for them. A lot of rich people are very irrational when it comes to the &#8216;finer&#8217; things in life such as wine and art because they can afford to be. Event still, I&#8217;d bet political irrationality is more wide-spread.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Floccina</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/03/wilkinson-on-pa.html#comment-407384</link>
		<dc:creator>Floccina</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Mar 2008 01:37:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/03/wilkinson-on-paternalism.html#comment-407384</guid>
		<description>Couldn&#039;t some paternalists, particularly the democratic paternalists say that 80% of the people are responsible enough to take care of themselves and to elect competent politicians to care for the irrational 20%?  Would they not say the most of the irrational are poor, poor in such a rich time and place due to being irrational?
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Couldn&#8217;t some paternalists, particularly the democratic paternalists say that 80% of the people are responsible enough to take care of themselves and to elect competent politicians to care for the irrational 20%?  Would they not say the most of the irrational are poor, poor in such a rich time and place due to being irrational?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Thomas J Wood</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/03/wilkinson-on-pa.html#comment-407383</link>
		<dc:creator>Thomas J Wood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Mar 2008 21:07:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/03/wilkinson-on-paternalism.html#comment-407383</guid>
		<description>This reminds me of the following exchange from the first episode of Invader Zim:

&lt;quote&gt;Zim: You can&#039;t have an invasion without me! I was in Operation Impending Doom 1! Don&#039;t you remember?
Tallest Purple: Oh yes. We remember…
(flashback)
Zim: (in giant robot destroying a city) AH HA HA HA HA HA HA!
Pilot: But sir, we&#039;re still on our own planet!
Zim: Silence! Twist those knobs! Twist those knobs! You! Pull some levers! Pull some levers!
(end of flashback)
Zim: I put the fires out.
Tallest Red: You made them worse!
Zim: Worse… or better?&lt;/quote&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This reminds me of the following exchange from the first episode of Invader Zim:</p>
<p><quote>Zim: You can&#8217;t have an invasion without me! I was in Operation Impending Doom 1! Don&#8217;t you remember?<br />
Tallest Purple: Oh yes. We remember…<br />
(flashback)<br />
Zim: (in giant robot destroying a city) AH HA HA HA HA HA HA!<br />
Pilot: But sir, we&#8217;re still on our own planet!<br />
Zim: Silence! Twist those knobs! Twist those knobs! You! Pull some levers! Pull some levers!<br />
(end of flashback)<br />
Zim: I put the fires out.<br />
Tallest Red: You made them worse!<br />
Zim: Worse… or better?</quote></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.overcomingbias.com/2008/03/wilkinson-on-pa.html#comment-407382</link>
		<dc:creator>anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Mar 2008 18:22:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2008/03/wilkinson-on-paternalism.html#comment-407382</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Government regulation is a political market, wherein the ultimate currency is based on one person one vote. Is there a better decision market?&lt;/i&gt;

Actually, whether democratic politics is an &quot;efficient decision market&quot; in some sense is a hotly debated question in political science and public choice theory.  One reference is Caplan, B. &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.gmu.edu/departments/economics/bcaplan/micfoundrev.doc&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&quot;Rational Irrationality and the Microfoundations of Political Failure&quot;&lt;/a&gt; Published in Public Choice 107(3/4), June 2001, pp.311-331. See also his work &quot;The Myth of the Rational Voter&quot; which discusses this issue in depth.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Government regulation is a political market, wherein the ultimate currency is based on one person one vote. Is there a better decision market?</i></p>
<p>Actually, whether democratic politics is an &#8220;efficient decision market&#8221; in some sense is a hotly debated question in political science and public choice theory.  One reference is Caplan, B. <a href="http://www.gmu.edu/departments/economics/bcaplan/micfoundrev.doc" rel="nofollow">&#8220;Rational Irrationality and the Microfoundations of Political Failure&#8221;</a> Published in Public Choice 107(3/4), June 2001, pp.311-331. See also his work &#8220;The Myth of the Rational Voter&#8221; which discusses this issue in depth.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
