Comments on: Introducing Ramone http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/07/introducing-ram.html Overcoming Bias is economist Robin Hanson’s blog, on honesty, signaling, disagreement, forecasting, and the far future. Sat, 11 Feb 2012 23:23:58 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.3 By: Overcoming Bias : Economists’ Best Advice http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/07/introducing-ram.html#comment-498842 Overcoming Bias : Economists’ Best Advice Mon, 29 Aug 2011 14:20:22 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2007/07/introducing-ramone.html#comment-498842 [...] Ramone: [...] [...] Ramone: [...]

]]> By: Katla on death as entertainment | Meteuphoric http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/07/introducing-ram.html#comment-467632 Katla on death as entertainment | Meteuphoric Sun, 06 Mar 2011 13:37:34 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2007/07/introducing-ramone.html#comment-467632 [...] so here you have a guest post from my mildly irate, judgemental and intellectually careless friend Katla. NB. We are only friends because we grew up in the same [...] [...] so here you have a guest post from my mildly irate, judgemental and intellectually careless friend Katla. NB. We are only friends because we grew up in the same [...]

]]> By: Hopefully Anonymous http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/07/introducing-ram.html#comment-418052 Hopefully Anonymous Sun, 15 Jul 2007 05:09:15 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2007/07/introducing-ramone.html#comment-418052 TGGP, I did write "possibly" ;-) But my solution to the is-ought problem is that universe ought to be optimized to maximize my personal odds of persistence (MMPOOP) as a subjective, conscious entity. From my solipstic perspective, anything else would be absurd. Apparently empiricism and other contributing elements of the scientific method are the best currently available way to figure out how to optimize the universe to MMPOOP. TGGP, I did write “possibly” ;-)

But my solution to the is-ought problem is that universe ought to be optimized to maximize my personal odds of persistence (MMPOOP) as a subjective, conscious entity. From my solipstic perspective, anything else would be absurd. Apparently empiricism and other contributing elements of the scientific method are the best currently available way to figure out how to optimize the universe to MMPOOP.

]]> By: TGGP http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/07/introducing-ram.html#comment-418051 TGGP Sun, 15 Jul 2007 03:20:07 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2007/07/introducing-ramone.html#comment-418051 Hopefully Anonymous, how do we discover moral truths empirically? Have you solved the is-ought problem? Hopefully Anonymous, how do we discover moral truths empirically? Have you solved the is-ought problem?

]]> By: Hopefully Anonymous http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/07/introducing-ram.html#comment-418050 Hopefully Anonymous Sat, 14 Jul 2007 22:14:52 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2007/07/introducing-ramone.html#comment-418050 Jim, It may also be important to explore the possibility that there are no moral truths to be gotten from the voting trance (or that can't be gotten more efficiently through other means). I suspect this is a view Robin is partial to, and frankly I am as well. But it's a question that possibly can be answered empirically. Jim,
It may also be important to explore the possibility that there are no moral truths to be gotten from the voting trance (or that can’t be gotten more efficiently through other means). I suspect this is a view Robin is partial to, and frankly I am as well. But it’s a question that possibly can be answered empirically.

]]> By: Jim Outen http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/07/introducing-ram.html#comment-418049 Jim Outen Sat, 14 Jul 2007 17:51:19 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2007/07/introducing-ramone.html#comment-418049 Robin, Very true, my proposals deal with the trance itself and not the moral truths. I don't know how it is possible to deal with the truths in another modern institution besides the voting theater, but feel it is easy to replicate a harmless version of the theater. Robin,

Very true, my proposals deal with the trance itself and not the moral truths. I don’t know how it is possible to deal with the truths in another modern institution besides the voting theater, but feel it is easy to replicate a harmless version of the theater.

]]> By: Hopefully Anonymous http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/07/introducing-ram.html#comment-418048 Hopefully Anonymous Sat, 14 Jul 2007 14:16:42 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2007/07/introducing-ramone.html#comment-418048 Jim Outen, Potentially great ideas and good brainstorming, even if they don't address Ramone's claims directly. I think thinking about "methods by which the mystical benefits of democracy could be separated from the wealth reducing realities often associated with democracy" is important, particularly if perpetuating the "mystical benefits of democracy" in some way creates material benefits which haven't yet been rigorously empirically demonstrated. Jim Outen,
Potentially great ideas and good brainstorming, even if they don’t address Ramone’s claims directly. I think thinking about “methods by which the mystical benefits of democracy could be separated from the wealth reducing realities often associated with democracy” is important, particularly if perpetuating the “mystical benefits of democracy” in some way creates material benefits which haven’t yet been rigorously empirically demonstrated.

]]> By: Robin Hanson http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/07/introducing-ram.html#comment-418047 Robin Hanson Sat, 14 Jul 2007 11:11:23 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2007/07/introducing-ramone.html#comment-418047 Jim, Ramone was claiming we need the voting trance to gain the moral insight that helps us make good choices, not just on symbolic choices, but also on choices that have big effects. Jim, Ramone was claiming we need the voting trance to gain the moral insight that helps us make good choices, not just on symbolic choices, but also on choices that have big effects.

]]> By: Jim Outen http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/07/introducing-ram.html#comment-418046 Jim Outen Sat, 14 Jul 2007 05:38:52 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2007/07/introducing-ramone.html#comment-418046 A few quick ideas concerning Ramone's argument that we need democracy to fulfill religious-like functions, yet at the same time we as a society (presumably) wish to avoid wealth-destroying policies: 1. Marketize more aspects of life and make democracy more "expressive" via increased symbolic voting. I think of recent symbolic votes by Democrats as an example of behavior (non-binding resolutions against the war). 2. Create less meaningful legislation; pass actual legislation which does essentially nothing. The public recognizes that the Congress has "done something" by voting and deliberating. 3. Pass legislation that satisfies public concerns, but simply fail to enforce the potentially wealth-reducing legislation. I can't think through all the game-theoretic implications of these proposals (does the public value the process of democracy or the results? will "learning" occur and greater feats of governmental theater be required to provide the religious benefits of democracy?) and therefore I suspect my proposals may be shortsighted. However, these could be methods by which the mystical benefits of democracy could be separated from the wealth reducing realities often associated with democracy. A few quick ideas concerning Ramone’s argument that we need democracy to fulfill religious-like functions, yet at the same time we as a society (presumably) wish to avoid wealth-destroying policies:

1. Marketize more aspects of life and make democracy more “expressive” via increased symbolic voting. I think of recent symbolic votes by Democrats as an example of behavior (non-binding resolutions against the war).

2. Create less meaningful legislation; pass actual legislation which does essentially nothing. The public recognizes that the Congress has “done something” by voting and deliberating.

3. Pass legislation that satisfies public concerns, but simply fail to enforce the potentially wealth-reducing legislation.

I can’t think through all the game-theoretic implications of these proposals (does the public value the process of democracy or the results? will “learning” occur and greater feats of governmental theater be required to provide the religious benefits of democracy?) and therefore I suspect my proposals may be shortsighted. However, these could be methods by which the mystical benefits of democracy could be separated from the wealth reducing realities often associated with democracy.

]]> By: TGGP http://www.overcomingbias.com/2007/07/introducing-ram.html#comment-418045 TGGP Fri, 13 Jul 2007 06:29:36 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2007/07/introducing-ramone.html#comment-418045 Caplan's writings on philosophy can be found <a href="http://www.gmu.edu/departments/economics/bcaplan/philos.html" rel="nofollow">here</a>. A pertinent piece, as you might guess from my previous post, is "The Is-Ought Problem". Caplan’s writings on philosophy can be found here. A pertinent piece, as you might guess from my previous post, is “The Is-Ought Problem”.

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