Comments on: You Are Never Entitled to Your Opinion http://www.overcomingbias.com/2006/12/you_are_never_e.html Overcoming Bias is economist Robin Hanson’s blog, on honesty, signaling, disagreement, forecasting, and the far future. Sat, 11 Feb 2012 23:23:58 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.3 By: yohami http://www.overcomingbias.com/2006/12/you_are_never_e.html#comment-461987 yohami Tue, 14 Dec 2010 19:29:50 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2006/12/you-are-never-entitled-to-your-opinion.html#comment-461987 I just wrote a post similar to this, I found yours checking for similar ideas in my experience this "im entitled", I get it mostly from girls? http://yohami.com/blog/2010/12/14/you-are-not-entitled-to-have-an-opinion/ I just wrote a post similar to this, I found yours checking for similar ideas

in my experience this “im entitled”, I get it mostly from girls?

http://yohami.com/blog/2010/12/14/you-are-not-entitled-to-have-an-opinion/

]]> By: Lightwave http://www.overcomingbias.com/2006/12/you_are_never_e.html#comment-423623 Lightwave Sat, 29 Dec 2007 16:05:44 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2006/12/you-are-never-entitled-to-your-opinion.html#comment-423623 Given a moderate amount of effort, your best estimate might obviously be wrong to someone who's put in much more resources and effort into solving a particular problem. And what's the practical difference between "the best estimate" and "opinion", anyway? Given a moderate amount of effort, your best estimate might obviously be wrong to someone who’s put in much more resources and effort into solving a particular problem. And what’s the practical difference between “the best estimate” and “opinion”, anyway?

]]> By: Robin Hanson http://www.overcomingbias.com/2006/12/you_are_never_e.html#comment-423622 Robin Hanson Fri, 28 Dec 2007 01:50:07 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2006/12/you-are-never-entitled-to-your-opinion.html#comment-423622 LG, I'm not so sure you can change your favorite color easily at will. Chris, you lost me. J, I never claimed you should make a large effort. But given any level of effort, there is your best estimate given that effort, and you have no right to believe anything else. LG, I’m not so sure you can change your favorite color easily at will.

Chris, you lost me.

J, I never claimed you should make a large effort. But given any level of effort, there is your best estimate given that effort, and you have no right to believe anything else.

]]> By: J Thomas http://www.overcomingbias.com/2006/12/you_are_never_e.html#comment-423621 J Thomas Thu, 27 Dec 2007 23:05:36 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2006/12/you-are-never-entitled-to-your-opinion.html#comment-423621 "<i>But never forget that on any question about the way things are (or should be), and in any information situation, there is always a best estimate. You are only entitled to your best honest effort to find that best estimate; anything else is a lie.</i>" I must disagree. When I have finite resources I must estimate how many of those resources are worth devoting to my answer for any particular question. The best estimate for how many resources to devote to finding a particular best estimate, depends on everything else that's worth my attention. I won't find out how much attention each topic is worth until I have thoroughly explored it in the context of everything else I know. This is not a trivial problem to solve. I say that an ethic which demands I must correctly solve a problem I cannot solve, is a bad ethic. “But never forget that on any question about the way things are (or should be), and in any information situation, there is always a best estimate. You are only entitled to your best honest effort to find that best estimate; anything else is a lie.”

I must disagree. When I have finite resources I must estimate how many of those resources are worth devoting to my answer for any particular question.

The best estimate for how many resources to devote to finding a particular best estimate, depends on everything else that’s worth my attention. I won’t find out how much attention each topic is worth until I have thoroughly explored it in the context of everything else I know.

This is not a trivial problem to solve. I say that an ethic which demands I must correctly solve a problem I cannot solve, is a bad ethic.

]]> By: Chris http://www.overcomingbias.com/2006/12/you_are_never_e.html#comment-423620 Chris Thu, 27 Dec 2007 19:34:12 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2006/12/you-are-never-entitled-to-your-opinion.html#comment-423620 Robin's post looks somewhat provocative and lightweight. He hasn't defined 'entitled', he hasn't defended his remark on not being entitled to 'I don't know'. He hasn't considered that an n-dimensioned reality is subject to n! different reductional representations, each of which is 'true'. Above all, he hasn't considered that the utility of continuing a discussion with someone whose arguments are confused and whose aims are obscure may be slight. Robin’s post looks somewhat provocative and lightweight. He hasn’t defined ‘entitled’, he hasn’t defended his remark on not being entitled to ‘I don’t know’. He hasn’t considered that an n-dimensioned reality is subject to n! different reductional representations, each of which is ‘true’. Above all, he hasn’t considered that the utility of continuing a discussion with someone whose arguments are confused and whose aims are obscure may be slight.

]]> By: LG http://www.overcomingbias.com/2006/12/you_are_never_e.html#comment-423619 LG Thu, 27 Dec 2007 18:57:17 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2006/12/you-are-never-entitled-to-your-opinion.html#comment-423619 I resolved the belief/opinion problem by more specifically defining them as objective and subjective respectively; meaning, one is a question of fact that is either the case or is not the case, the other is a question of preference that has no correctness state. When people retort a statement of fact I make with "That's just your opinion," I correct them by saying that it's not an opinion at all -- it's a belief, and our beliefs (as is often the case is exchanges like these) cannot both be correct at the same time. That's why I can like the color blue and never be wrong, but I can be wrong if I'm a [insert pet hated religion or movement practitioner], since said movement makes claims of fact about reality. You are correct though, Robin, in that once I hold an opinion about the color blue, there is a claim of fact to be made about what my favorite color truly is, but I think that's kind of pedantic since I can honestly and truly change my favorite at will, since it's a property of me not of the color. I resolved the belief/opinion problem by more specifically defining them as objective and subjective respectively; meaning, one is a question of fact that is either the case or is not the case, the other is a question of preference that has no correctness state.

When people retort a statement of fact I make with “That’s just your opinion,” I correct them by saying that it’s not an opinion at all — it’s a belief, and our beliefs (as is often the case is exchanges like these) cannot both be correct at the same time.

That’s why I can like the color blue and never be wrong, but I can be wrong if I’m a [insert pet hated religion or movement practitioner], since said movement makes claims of fact about reality.

You are correct though, Robin, in that once I hold an opinion about the color blue, there is a claim of fact to be made about what my favorite color truly is, but I think that’s kind of pedantic since I can honestly and truly change my favorite at will, since it’s a property of me not of the color.

]]> By: Robin Hanson http://www.overcomingbias.com/2006/12/you_are_never_e.html#comment-423618 Robin Hanson Sun, 24 Dec 2006 22:53:37 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2006/12/you-are-never-entitled-to-your-opinion.html#comment-423618 Joseph, in this post I've said nothing about disagreement. Disagreement has been, and will continue to be, discussed in other posts here at Overcoming Bias. Joseph, in this post I’ve said nothing about disagreement. Disagreement has been, and will continue to be, discussed in other posts here at Overcoming Bias.

]]> By: Joseph Sinatra http://www.overcomingbias.com/2006/12/you_are_never_e.html#comment-423617 Joseph Sinatra Sun, 24 Dec 2006 20:57:30 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2006/12/you-are-never-entitled-to-your-opinion.html#comment-423617 Robin, Granted that there is a 'best' estimate for any information situation and therefore like you say, one is only entitled to their best honest effort to find that best estimate, cannot individuals come to different conclusions as to what the best estimate is, depending on how they value different pieces of that information set? Different individuals could come to different 'best' judgements about what 'ought' to be because even with the 'same' information situations, some could think certain aspects of that information is more important than other aspects. For example, I'm thinking of different ways of assessing social justice. Robin,

Granted that there is a ‘best’ estimate for any information situation and therefore like you say, one is only entitled to their best honest effort to find that best estimate, cannot individuals come to different conclusions as to what the best estimate is, depending on how they value different pieces of that information set?

Different individuals could come to different ‘best’ judgements about what ‘ought’ to be because even with the ‘same’ information situations, some could think certain aspects of that information is more important than other aspects.

For example, I’m thinking of different ways of assessing social justice.

]]> By: randpost http://www.overcomingbias.com/2006/12/you_are_never_e.html#comment-423616 randpost Sat, 23 Dec 2006 12:26:54 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2006/12/you-are-never-entitled-to-your-opinion.html#comment-423616 You are not entitled to have an opinion about one being entitled to his opinion You are not entitled to have an opinion about one being entitled to his opinion

]]> By: Ray G http://www.overcomingbias.com/2006/12/you_are_never_e.html#comment-423615 Ray G Fri, 22 Dec 2006 05:00:18 +0000 http://prod.ob.trike.com.au/2006/12/you-are-never-entitled-to-your-opinion.html#comment-423615 Also, and this may be reading too much into this, but couldn't multiple best estimates to get to one truth segue into Poincare's science/philosophy? Also, and this may be reading too much into this, but couldn’t multiple best estimates to get to one truth segue into Poincare’s science/philosophy?

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